My worst SD incident was while tanking an RAF Harrier GR3 across Canada. It happened in good vis conditions but poor horizon at about 25,000 ft. I was in trail to one side about 500 yds behind the tanker (a Victor) , another Harrier on the other side. I could see the tanker, but was suddenly convinced that it had entered a screaming death dive. Every bone in my body said I was going vertically down, and I instinctively pulled back on the stick. I promptly got behing the drag curve, and lost sight of the gas station. It tok about 45 mins for me to get my internal gyros sorted and regain formation with the tanker with the help of a radar controller. Just goes to show that SD can happen in pretty benign conditions and can be very scary.
--Gerry Humphreys hum@esatclear.ie
CFIs should induce spatial disorientation to every student. My primary instructor was very good at it. It was a grat learning aid ! Thanks Dave -
--Bill Mitchell
Questions 2 and 3 should allow multiple answers. I sume many of us have been disoriented in more than one type of flight conditions.
reached down to pick up a pencil.
F-86 High Flight, US to Spain, island hopping in '56. Lost all instruments at altitude approaching Scotland, turned lead over to wingman. Penetration from altitude (tops @ FL280) and GCA to about 1100' and I was certain I was upside down all the way, even through gear down. Thank God for a super smooth wingman to take over! (Worst case I had in 20+ years.)
--Morton Mumma
During instrument training I kept reading about spatial disorientation but never experienced it in my VFR days. I specifically remember reading about an accident that occurred off the coast of Florida (Gulf side, I think) in which the pilot put it in the ocean on approach to one of the coast's aipports. I didn't understand how that could have happened in good weather. Therefore, I picked a sunny, but hazy, day and went up in a 172 out over Lake Erie on the East coast of Michigan. I didn't do it haphazardly, I thought about my "out" in advance of going so I knew how to react without delay. Sure enough, I got about 1-2 miles off shore out over the lake and tried to concentrate on the outside horizon that wasn't very distinguishable, and I almost immediately got vertigo. Almost as quickly as it happend, I looked over my shoulder and out the side window for the shoreline; once in sight I started a turn back towards land concentrating on the shore and horizon (sun was no mostly behind me so the apparent visibility wasn't as severe in the haze as it was on the outbound leg. Needless to say, the next few lessons in my IR-A training included emphasis on believing what the instruments say and not what I was feeling (unusual attitudes, actual imc, etc.). I went on to get my rating and fortunately have not had another experience of spatial disorientation.
--P.J. Madding
In 1944 Army Air Force training, this condition was induced to demonstrate importance of maintaining confidence in the instruments.
Only took once to learn the lesson. Thanks the forces that be that we are both pilots and could rely on each other one to fly and the other to talk to ATC and help read instruments. After that we are both now in instrument training. DON'T WAIT, GET THE IFR TICKET RIGHT AWAY.
--John Gray
Night instrument approach in a snow storm, after an extended flight over water. High intensity approach lights plus runway end strobes caused disorientation combined with exhaustion.
When you depart DXR 8 (Danbury CT) it is a climing left turn. The terrain is rising as you enter the cloud. Most ot the time I feel like the plane is falling off to the left and decending. It might be reflection of sound off the rising hill because you have 400 - 500 ft of altitude and are running full power. Very simply, you follow the gauges. 2800 hrs, SMEL, 500 IFR
--Miles Reese
anyone who flies IFR and says he HASN'T is an (ahem) liar. it's part of IFR flying. answ = "believe the instruments"!
It's not uncommon for a formation wingman to feel the leader is doing all sorts of gyrations, even barrel rolls! An occasional glance down at the horizon reference instrument provides a good 'quick fix'.
remain ifr current...don,t over estimate your own abilities...things can go wrong very quickly as a single pilot with lots of work load
--ronnie van wijk
I had problems flying IMC or Hooded. I think it was due to the fact that, like most IFR pilots, I waited until the 6th month to do any hood work. Since I have found my IFR skills deterorating, I have committed to flying IFR once a month. Not only an I a better IFR pilot, and feel much more confortable in the clouds, but I no longer get spatial disorientation.
Wish I could select more then one answer to question 2, becuase over 20+ years, all of the above would be the correct answer. As it is, majority have occoured with no moon, scattered ground lights (NO horizon) and CAVU. Look down at a chart, pick up a dropped pencil, quickly look back up - and pow. Espiscialy after a long, stressful day.
--Jeff Pelton
Ok, to better answer #2, on a night training flight, under VFR conditions in the Daytona Beach area, we were preforming steep turns. After 180 degrees of turn, facing due east with no stars or boats on the ocean I lost all sense of direction. After informing my instructor that I was going inside because I wasn't sure which way was up, I rolled out and continued in a standard rate turn back to where there was land. Several other times I've been close to disoriented, but my training was able to trust the instruments and I'm here to say it.
--George Cox someone19@earthlink.net
Hazy conditions over water are not fun.
Instructor intentionally took us into a harmless cumulus, did some fancy maneuvers "in the white" and not allowing me to look at the panel, gave me the controls saying "fly". I felt comfortable, but, just before we came out of the cloud, I was noticing something was "wrong" with the insruments. To my expletive-deleted surprise, we were at the the top of a loop when I FOR SURE believed we were in straight-and-level conditions.
--Martin Holmes
Happened when flying in very marginal VFR conditions due to atmospheric pollution haze. I was fine until other traffic reported their positions close to mine, and the workload increased sharply. Once I realised, I told the passenger to keep a look out, and concentrated on the dials.
i think that true (and this is an opinion, obviously) spatial disorientation is on about the same level as being "a little" pregnant. isn't it what we, as pilots, try to avoid in any circumstances?
I lost the horizon over the Chesapeke Bay on a hot hazy day. I also lost the horizon on a night time climb out of an airport in a remote area. I'm a low time pilot (105 hours) and I did as I was trained and concentrated on my instruments. Not panicing is the key.
--Patrick Dean pat.dean@bigfoot.com
IMC in C-172 flying left seat. Felt like aircraft was turning to left while instruments showed straight and level. When I exited IMC conditions, I asked my instrumented rated pilot friend in the right seat if he had felt any disorientation. He stated he thought the aircraft had been turning to the right while we were IMC!!!!!!
--Richard Steckel
I was really amazed how quick spatial disorientation can set in. Departing off rwy 24 at MVY takes you over water if you remain on the runway heading. When the visibility is reduced due to haze you dont have an horizon. All it took for me was to try to find an horizon and *boom*, instant spatial disorientation. This happen in daytime VFR with the visibility at 8 miles. Realizing what had just taken place, I immediatly went on instruments and within what seemed like an enternity which was really only a matter of some 20 seconds or so, had everything back under control. This was the second time departing from MVY that I have encountered this problem. Both times I was able to regain control and continue the flight. Like I've stated before, spatial disorientation is my biggest fear about flying.
--Buddy Wyatt breeze@mvweb.com
2(f) Aerobatics
I had never flown an airplane before. A friend gave my husband and me a chance to experience flying his acrobatic biplane during a family vacation. On the outward bound trip he put my tall husband into the front seat and tossed a small pillow into the hangar and I joined the rest of the family in the car. The homeward bound trip was my turn to sit in the front seat and try out flying an airplane. As we took off and I peered over the glareshield and saw nothing but the featureless blue California sky, I the use for the pillow in the hangar. I FLEW the plane, porpoising (on purpose) to catch glimpses of the horizon and did very well. But on the rollout from the downwind to base turn when I pushed the nose down I couldn't find the ground and felt very wierd. With only blue everywhere I suddenly believed every direction was up. I immediately tried to make sense of the three instruments before me, but realized I had no idea how to use them and precious little time to figure them out. So, not quite understanding this new sensation I claimed, somewhat inaccurately, "You do it, I'm scared." I learned on that flight that I CAN FLY an airplane and that my instincts are good. I have never experience spatial disorientation in quite so dramatic a fashion since even though my CFIs have made sure to induce it.
happened in an Aztec, going too fast over the initial app fix, looked down too long at app plate (on knees) and looked up to find the plane in a 45 degree bank, major vertico on leveling wings , really had to fight to believe the instruments, now when i look away i lighten grip on yoke to ensure no subtle turns
--Dennis Fox
The closest I came was in summertime haze at night in NY Center's area and no one would talk to me, which was after a long,hot day and at the golf course/office - very tiring, frustrating and annoying but not disorienting. But thankfully never have experienced a disorientation situation requiring me to force myself to concentrate on the instruments or else.
The conditions were severe clear, but out over the desert south of PHX. The tail was toward the city so there were no lights in front of us. At least it happened while I was training for my instrument rating.
I've also had disorientation induced in training. I was subjected to a Barany chair before I began IFR training. It made me a believer in ignoring your body and concentrating on the instruments. In my case I had slight disorientation and just focused on the basics - straight and level flight. Once I got stabilized, it was over.
Years ago, I was flying night IMC descending into good VFR when I became concerned about icing. While I was paying more attention to holding the wing icing light down and peering out the side window, my airplane was busy going into a descending steep turn! When I decided to wake up, the instruments became my focus and the plane was quickly back on target. Lesson learned, I wiped the sweat off my brow and concentrated on slowing my heart rate down. The incidint scared the daylights (pun intended) out of me. I've never made a mistake like that again. It made me a better instrument pilot.
I teach spatial disorientation at a major flying college, and still experienced coriolis anad a bad case of the leans. It can happen to anyone!
--George LaMora lamora@aero.und.edu
Just like the book says, "believe the instruments and fly them" It's hard to do, but it works. beats the heck out of a smoking hole.
--Paul Davis
I have never been as disoriented as I was one dark, moonless night over Cambodian controlling an airstrike for a long-range reconnaissance patrol (LRRP) observing the Ho Chi Minh Trail. In that part of Indochina there were absolutely no lights on the ground, and a high overcast obscured the stars. Other than the red lights in my cockpit, the only other lights were the parachute flares the LRRP team would occasionally lob over the truck convoy on the trail trying to help me and our strike fighters find the target. It was a real challenge trying to stay oriented as I maneuvered over the target making passes to fire marking rockets for the fighters. More than once I had to stop, hold wings level, concentrate on the instruments, and wait for the fluid in my ear canals to stop sloshing around before I could continue.
--Gary Dikkers
On a clear but very hazy day three months after getting my private license, I was enroute from Ocean City NJ (26N) to my home base, Gaithersburg MD (GAI), with my family on board. At 6500' I had no horizon, so I came down to 4500. This was fine until I got out over Delaware Bay, when I suddenly realized I had no horizon. I stared out through the windshield but could see absolutely no horizon, and I started to feel as if the nose of the airplane was hunting across the horizon, left and right. But when I looked at the instruments they showed straight and level. This scared the bejasus out of me, and I immediately came down to 2500', where I had a horizon. Flight over water in conditions of restricted forward visibility immediately went into my "never again" file. Fortunately, I came through all this without scaring my passengers, who never had any idea anything was wrong, but I certainly scared myself silly.
--Andrew Smith
If you have flown a significant amount in IMC, there is no doubt you have experienced spatial disorientation.
It happened twice. Once during an ILS approach and the other while enroute. Both times I was IMC and both times I disregarded what my senses were telling me and focused on the instrument panel.
Everyone I have ever flown with has at one time or another experienced spatial disorentation (vertigo) at one time or another while flying on the gauges. For that reason I take my students out and put them under the hood at night so that they have no other cues and are more likely to experience vertigo.
--Brian Lloyd
I was in the left seat of a Navy P-3. we took off from Elmendorf AFB in Anchorage, AK. On climb out we encountered Aurora Borealis of the most beautiful kind that I had ever witnessed - all the colors of the rainbow - that actually enveloped the aircraft. We got clearance for a 360 turn just to marvel a little longer. The lights created a false horizon that lasted over one hour into the flight causing me to force myself to believe the artificial horizon.
--CDR Philip R. Kennedy
This was in an Air Force C118 (DC6B) in 1958 while taking off from Stephenville, Newfoundland at dusk with 100 ft ceiling and 1/4 mi viz; max gross wgt. After V2 speed I experienced a feeling that someone was pulling my seat back and the aircraft was nose high as if in a stalled angle of attack. I relaxed slightly on the yoke and the sensation continued. I bore down hard concentrating on the instruments and the illusion disappeared. It was scary but I remembered my Air Force training about don't believe in anything but the guages.
--Walt Echwald
The only time I've experienced spatial disorientation was early-on in my flying career. I had about 20 hours past my private and was flying at night over water. Overcame the sensation with help from the instruments. That experience frazzled me to the point that I made a host of mistakes throughout the remainder of the flight -- including making a landing on the opposite runway from what I was calling. I learned a lot about flying from that experience.
--Cecil McGavern cmcgavern@yahoo.com
The conditions were night, VFR, moonless, over a river with lighted areas within 10 miles. The light reflections on the "inside" of the canopy glass gave false impressions of the aircraft attitude.
It was a dark night flying back from Key west to Ft. Lauderdale.There were no ground references as we were flying direct over water and in hazy,although unreported, conditions.I swore we were straight and level as the VSI was level. On a more thorough instrument scan , I discovered we were in a 15 degree bank turning south !Luckily, that's as "hairy" as it got.I recovered,and stayed glued to the panel until we saw the lights of Miami ! It is surprisingly easy to see what happened to JFK,Jr.I now have my instrument rating ( which I would highly recommend every pilot seriously consider).
--Joel Kamphuis kampjoel@aol.com
Flew through a cloud. I will never do that again.
Night IFR at under a very high overcast while cruising around 33,000 ft over the Indian Ocean. The stratus above blocked view of the stars and the moon had not risen yet. There were apparently a lot of fishing boats on the surface of the sea and they appeared the same as stars with some bright ones and very dim ones. The autopilot was engaged and the longer you looked down the more you became convinced that the aircraft was inverted. Fixing my eyes on the ADI I just kept saying blue is up, black is down and nothing is wrong. We finally coasted out far enough so that the boats diminished and I felt better, especially when the overcast cleared and the moon rose, convincing my that my instruments were correct all along.
--jim nothstine
Flying UH-1 helicopter the collective pitch appeared to be in front of me rather than on the left side, had to mentally look around it to see the instruments and eventually it returned to its normal location
--Tom Schnaubelt
I found flying in acutal IMC "easier" then under the hood. Having the sun and shadows meander across the panel during training was very distracting. Feeling disoriented made it harder to concentrate on the "Six Pack". But when in the Clag, dont look out too much or it will get you!
Distractions can be deadly in IMC...I was lucky, and it made me a much better, conscious instrument pilot.
--Eric Cipcic
Night VFR overwater cruise with much circling required by mission.
A short story about real life aviation. > > As most of you know, I commute to and from Hollister (K3O7) every Sunday. > You also know that I am IFR (Instrument Flight Rules) current and fly a lot > of actual IFR in and out of our persistent Marine Layer. I was not surprised > to hear that Oakland Airport (KOAK) had such a Marine Layer as I was > returning from Hollister today. The exact report was: "Visibility 10, 700' > few, Ceiling 1,200' BKN, 2,500 OVC." It was obvious that I would need an IFR > clearance and would be actual IMC (Instrument Meteorological Conditions). I > knew that the ILS (Instrument Landing System) would be the only way to get > home. Note that in my precious N9162H, I fly ILS approaches at 90 Knots (110 > MPH). I have always been taught and taught others to fly the airplane over > and above anything else. If ATC (Air Traffic Control) made special requests, > I would try to comply if I was comfortable with the request and was sure > that I could still fly the airplane. I was certain that I could never be > pressured to go "out of my envelope". The final approach controller issued > my IFR clearance and at the end asked, "62H what speed can you maintain on > the ILS?" I had heard his conversation with other aircraft and knew that he > was setting up a number of aircraft behind me for the ILS. (Keep in mind > that the ATC system is first come, first served. I was first.) I realized > that he had asked that question because there were two airplanes behind me > that fly the approach at 140 and 160 Knots. I responded that I could fly the > approach at 120 Knots. I intercepted the final approach course and > glideslope at about 100 Knots. The controller then asked me to maintain best > possible forward speed for faster traffic behind. ( Are you getting nervous > here? I was!) Since I was now descending on the glideslope, it was easy to > add power and achieve 140 Knots. (Gotta help those guys behind me. NOT) I > was solid IMC going through 3,000'. I was exactly where I should have been > but watching the airspeed indicator too much. In the period of about fifteen > seconds, I notice that I was in a forty degree left turn. (Standard Rate > Turns are twenty degrees) My body gave no clue of turning. My descent rate > increased to 1,000 feet per minute. I felt as if I was flying straight and > level! True vertigo! I can't tell you much about my thought process during > the next few seconds. I'd like to think that I was pretty analytical. My > body was lying to me, the instruments were telling the truth. I believed > them, stopped the turn and arrested the descent rate. I then slowed to my > customary 90 Knots and decided I no longer cared about the airplanes behind > me. The rest of the approach was perfect with the runway right on the nose > when I broke out of the clouds. > > The Lesson: Don't try to be the 'good guy' if it pushes your envelope. > Believe and understand what your instruments are telling you, not what your > body is telling you! > > Now, I'm going to have a Scotch! > > Robert >
--Robert J. Ovanin robmar@ix.netcom.com
Moonless night oveere the desert doing 360s
Was with a friend over the coast on hazy day. He was doing manouevers for his commercial check ride. I felt like we were turning and looked at the panel. I noticed that the turn was tightening and the nose coming up. Told him about it and we both went on the gauges. Also had bad case of the tumbles flying at night under overcast over poorly lighted area. Was low time. Had an aircraft fly under me and made a few quick head movements and it happened. Almost reached out to the panel with my hand to keep from tumbling head over heels. Went on the gauges, stopped the turn and climb. Then peeked over the glareshield. Saw a light on the ground and the sensation stopped. Doing airbatics usually tilts my internal gyros and sometime lunch starts toward the upper exit. Now as a CFI I always get my student to experience disorientation in both day and night conditions.
--Leo H. LeBoeuf leo.leboeuf@rifocs.com
I was training with my IFR instructor at the time on a cloudy winter evening near IXD Olathe, KS. We had completed a series of approaches and holds over TOP in Topeka, KS and were entering the approach to the ILS 35 at IXD. We were maintaining VFR but I had been under the hood for nearly an hour by this point and was starting to tire. Suddenly, I swore the plane was starting to turn right and climb even though everything on the panel told me otherwise. Fortunately I told my instructor about it immediately and being the good retired Navy pilot he is said "...fly the instruments!" I ignored my senses and concentrated on the "T" scanning attitude, airspeed, altitude, DG, VSI, etc. About a minute later everything started to make sense again and the sweat started to subside. We flew two more ISL 35 approaches at IXD that night, landed, and went home. I was never more mentally exhausted than after that night of flying and now feel it was invaluable to feel that sense of disorientation with my IFR instructor around. I have experienced it several times since and have always remembered that winter night during my IFR training to get me through it. I'm sure the next time it happens, and you can bet it will, I'll remember my instructor's voice saying "...fly the instruments!" and how important it is to be proficient at instrument flying and knowing when disorientation occurs so as to react accordingly.
--Roger A. Luty
3d. I was able to see land off my right wing. I changed course slightly to the right and continued on my cross country with no additional problem.
--Donald Laurila Dlaur83276@aol.com
I was a passanger on a DC3 flying over Cape Cod. I was young, did not yet have my pilot's license. We were going in and out of clouds, and it was bumpy. I looked down to the floor for some reason, lifted my head back up, and I thought the entire airplane was spinning around violently along it's longitudal axis. I could not tell if we were upside down or not. I thought we were going to crash, but realized this was a bizarre and scary illusion that I could not explain and that did not match the broken cloudscape out my passager window. Only later, through my flight training, did I understand what I experienced....
--Heinrich C. Bofinger
I was taking off out of Prescott, Az. While climbing out towards the city, I made a right turn out of the pattern into a wall of desert darkness.
In the busy New York Class B airspace (and other Class B areas as well, I presume), it is normal for aircraft departing smaller airports in the area to be given numerous turns immediately after departure in order to vector them safely around the "big iron" to their first waypoint. I have sometimes experienced a "touch of vertigo" if I climb into IMC during these times, as the quick turns (while climbing and levelling off) can be unsettling.
--James Christie
I was shooting an ILS approach into Charleston, W. VA. I broke out of the clouds into dark low invisiblility conditions. There were just a scattering of point light sources below me in the sparsely populated area northeast of Charleston and solid black all around me. When I looked up the visual cues told me I was upside down. I went back unto instruments right away and just continued the approach and landed.
Experienced veritgo one other time day VFR in late afternoon westbound in heavy haze. AH failed and slowly tilted and stuck in 20 degree bank. Had to cover AH in order to get over vertigo.
--Bill Zollinger
Conditions were very hazy over water with a long narrow cloud in my 12 o'clock position that was lying on an angle. Eventually, it appeared to me that it was my plane, not the cloud, that was angled.
--Joey Arbaugh
My spatial disorientation occurred as I was climbing from VFR into the base of a cloud and had just been swiveling my head looking for traffic. Concentrating on the gages allowed me to overcome the disorientation within a few minutes. However, with 5,000 feet of clear air below me there was definitely a temptation to descend back into the clear. I would have chosen that option (along with notifying ATC) if I'd noticed any aircraft control problems or if the disorientation remained for more than those few minutes.
--Greg Haack
Spatial disorientation (vertigo) is something that any pilot who has flown in actual instrument meteorological conditions, or overwater at night, has or will experience at one point or another during his flying career. In over 40 years of military and civilian flying, I have come across it on countless occasions. It is best faced by preparing yourself for it by accepting that its onset may come about at any time there are no visual outside clues. When it does appear, it is just a matter of recognizing its presence and flying the instruments with total reliance on them. It is certainly an eerie feeling but one gets a sens of true accomplishment when it is overcome. Its danger can never be underestimated.
--Gabriel I. Peqagarmcano guigo34@hotmail.com
Spatial disorientation was intentionally induced by my instructor during my instrument training work. During training in actual IMC, my instructor also had me perform various movements with my body/head(leaning over, turning head quickly, etc.) to induce S.D. This provided an "actual" feeling of disorientation and the requirement of concentration and trust in the instruments.
--David B. Maxwell
It was during the fires in Florida durinbg the summere of 1998. I was a new pilot and was flying back form a golf outing in NC. the Daytona Beach controler was calm and helpfull and pointed out Ormand Beach to me. I landed on then first runway available. the controller contacted me on the ground tomke sure I was ok. I had none pilot with me and no idea what my problem was and I had no time to explain. I told him to just stay quiet and let me work. All turned out fine , thanks the the help of the controler and the instructors ihad during my training.
I was training for my Instrument rating. I did it to myself by looking down to pick up a chart. I advised my instructure and then (under the hood) I fought off the strange sensations.
--Ed Rosiak
I was training under the hood performing steep turns at night. I rolled out to what my body felt was straight and level. My instructor had to strongly encourage me to double-check my instruments.
--Roy Ott
Spatial disorientation can happen to anybody, regardless of expierience or training, day or night, over land or water.
--Jim Borger borger@msn.com
Night, hazy, marginal VFR, three F-84Fs practice air refueling on KC97. I had finished refueling and was sitting on the right wing of the tanker. After taking my eye off the tanker to check my instruments, When I looked back, I thought I was in a climbing left turn which, if continued, I would have collided with the tanker. I barrel-rolled to the right, jumped on the instruments, regained my composure and rejoined. No one knew I had a problem, and of course, I didn't--t only seemed like it.
During a night rating training session (in Canada) I was under the hood while we penetrated cloud for my first time. Needless to say that hood training leaves alot to be desired compared to flying in real IMC. Peripheral vision still comes into play when donning most training hoods. I found that my effort required to maintain the climb and wings level had increased substantially. The whole effect was amplified by the fact that I kept the taxi light on for increased visiblity and this caused a quite a distraction and contributed to my disorientation as I could still see the intermittent white 'flashes' in the corner of my eye. (wing mounted taxi light in a Cessna 172).
Only experienced it in the FAA's "Invertigo" demonstrator at the Reno Air Races. It's a real eye-opener to experience vertigo, rather than just read about it. FAA travels around and sets it up at airshows. If you ever see it - try it out!
--Jim Crandell
Smoke from forest fires caused loss of horizon.
--Randy Kilbourn
it happens! especially if a seat of the pants pilot, like myself, flies something that is inherently unstable. ie the 727-100 seroies of aircraft. The natural sensations of coordinated flight went out the window with that one..
--e.e. hilbert
The best flight simulators in the world operate entirely on fooling the senses that the sensed attitude is different from the actual, i. e., spatial disorientation. If that wasn't possible, simulators won't be possible. Just look at a simulator in operation from the outside for proof of the above statement. The possibility of spatial disorientation is always there. Regrettably, the smaller,more maneuverable the plane the more likely. There's no training to avoid it; there's just training (and experience) to handel it.
1957 we were flying back to college on at night in heavy snow squalls VFR. We were in and out of the heavy snow then the plane entered a spin, it happened just before we came out so we had ground reference to recover...had the bad taste of copper pennies in my mouth for the rest of the flight.
--chuck raymond
This occurred on a missed approach in IMC. Every time I looked down at my charts my hands would move the yoke to "correct" the sensations of turning. I finally had to let go of the controls whenever I looked away from the instruments. It lasted for about 15 minutes.
--Jeff M. Crain jmc@tonesoft.com
It was my own fault, launching into MVFR/IMC (I'm not instrument rated) and I was shocked by how quickly I got disoriented. Once I realized what was happening to me, I straightened out by REALLY concentrating on my instruments and getting up there above the haze. The next step in my training will be IFR training!
--Ed Winne
Vertigo from focusing on a single light on the horizon which I thought might be another aircraft. Alone in a C172 with no autopilot and just over 3 hours instrument training. As the results of this survey indicate, a lot of pilots have experienced spatial disorientation and lived to tell about it. The Kennedy case was an anomaly, and may well have involved more than simple spatial disorientation.
--Dick Madding madding@dnaco.net
Learning aerobatics over the ocean. Instructor took over after I got confused trying to do a cloverleaf.
I could answer the 2nd question: "All of the above at one time or another." The asnswer to 3 is always, "Pay attention to ALL the flight instruments." The first time it happened to me solo, it wasn't until the mag compass and tach were stabilized and in agreement with the altimeter, and gyro instruments, that I was convinced, things were OK. No NAVCOM the first time, but I remember it like yesterday.
--Alexander French
Riding in an open solo boatswain's chair balloon seat at about 8,000 agl, I was approached by a large flight of crow type birds which swarmed around in a wave type motion. I became woozey and could not maintain my seating. By strongly concentrating on my hand grip on the seat frame and closing my eyes, the instability subsided. Opening my eyes the birds were a hundred yards or so away, but still flying in a pulsating, undulating movement which caused my disorientation to return. The sensation quickly left as the birds got farther away. In a minute or two I was fully recovered and couldn't believe that it really happened and that it actually took control of my motor sensations and control.
--Don Piccard
Spatial disorientation is inevitable when flying as a wingman in formation in the weather. It is the ultimate exercise in self discipline to maintain your formation position when your head tells you that you are upside down or diving vertically into the ground.
--R. Grant Lannon
Autopilot was available, and next option to be exercised, but caught the vertigo early and recovery was quick once I concentrated on the instruments and ignored the false sensory input. Putting your life in the trust of the gages does work, and in your spare time it's a 'must' to cross-check them while you use them.
while flying a C130A on a training flight at night, we flew into a sloping cloud bank whereby both pilots became disoriented and since the aircraft was on autopilot, we only advised ATC of our problem and that we would only continue to fly straight and level until both pilots recovered. It took approximately 3 minutes to accomplish the recovery but the time seemed like an eternity.
--Bob Wilson
Under IMC your servival depended on being able to see and understand the instruments. My case was caused by bending over to reach a switch to turn the strob lights off. It happens fast......... and the
--Bud
Was IMC at night and broke out on top, looked at horizon (?) and leveled wings to match. Noticed increase in air noise and nose getting heavy. Looked at instruments, was in approx 45 to 50 degree bank. Leveled wings, stayed on gages and did not look outside the cockpit again. Soon began letdown for instrument approach, back in clouds did approach to near minimums and all was well. Lesson learned.
As a naval aviator flying fighter aircraft, spatial disorientation is not uncommon. As a single-seat pilot, we are always sensitive to the problem. Often occurred when flying "wing" at night or IMC with a lead pilot who is "too smooth" in his turns. We just learn to "deal with it" just like disbarism.
--Rick Wallace
The only time I have expierienced spatial disorientation was when I was training for my private pilot certificate. My instructor put me through about thirty minutes of "recovery from unusual attitudes" - "needle, ball, airspeed". It was comfortable with my instructor there, but I'm sure it would be a lot more nerve racking in a real situation. I only have about 70 hours logged, so I am glad I have not yet expierienced "true" spatial disorientation. I hope that if I ever do, I will fare better than JFK Jr., or the many like him, that ended with tragic results.
--Jason D. Baker
You can be fully in control of the aircraft and still be experiencing Spatial Disorientation. It is usually a matter of experience and training that keeps the aircraft under control.
While I was trained in VMC for inadvertent IFR, and to do the immediate 180, I still was not prepared for the overwhelming nature of spatial disorientation. During a hangar flying session, the week before my spatial disorientation, one of the pilots said "die by your instruments. Just because the seat of your pants quit working in the clouds does not mean your instruments quit working. No matter what, make the instruments look correct. I did, and I survived, much humbled. My students now get actual practice in the 180 in IMC (negotiated on an IFR clearance with ATC). I think it enhances safety to have the experience in a controlled environment, rather than all alone.
--Jer/ Eberhard jer@fc.hp.com
I was flying to Athes GA from Daytona FL at night. On the middle of the route i start getting into IMC. I try to look for the horizotal but it didn't work. :) So I continue the flight by the instruments
--Mikhael de Britto Ponso mikabp@hotmail.com
admit to yourself how serious the situation is and trust the instruments!
While in Viet Nam I was a door gunner on UH-1's and would fly at night on occasion. One very clear night I did get disoriented. I mentioned to the pilot that I was not sure which way was up and he told me to keep looking at my feet and repeat 'my feet are down' until I returned to the known 'up' feeling. It worke in a few seonds and did not return. After the flight we talked this over and came to the conclusion the condition was caused by the very clear night and the lack of concentrated lights in my view. The stars just blended to the scattered lights on the ground or the other way around.
--Tim Shaver
I was flying a night IFR approach to the carrier, chasing the final inbound course since the ship was turning, trying to find the wind. I had been in a 30 deg bank for probably 30 seconds when I broke out at about 400 feet. The ship was at my 11 o'clock in a 30 degree bank! I could not shake the feeling that _I_ was the one straight-and-level and the ship had the bank angle. I mustered all the self-control I could find and flew up the flight deck in a '30-deg bank' on a go-around. After climbing out and leveling off, the disorientation faded, and I was able to fly a normal approach the next time around. Very weird feeling with my eyes and ears giving me, very emphatically, different information.
--cole pierce, usn (ret.) slainte@ghg.net
While on a pleasure flight in day VFR conditions along the shoreline of a large lake, I lost sight of the horizon over the lake due to slight haze. Since the airplane I fly is very old and has no artificial horizon, I immediately returned my flightpath inland. I never lost control, but the sensation that I was becoming spatially disoriented was very strong. It only takes a couple seconds to lose track of "up and down". I was only at an altitude of 1800ft MSL, and I can imagine what might have happened, had I ignored the situation and continued on.In my opinion, if you have the instruments in your panel, and you fly VFR, get familiar with using the artificial horizon in practice with a safety pilot on board. So many times we fly for fun and get comfortable with using outside references only and when a situation comes up where use of the gages is necessary, we are all too "rusty". And those of us who haven't the luxury of modern technology in our aged aircraft should stick to GOOD VFR conditions.
It happened to me late one night, flying a 172 down through a scattered/broken layer. I was on an instrument flight plan on one of those nights with awesome conditions and visibility, but with a nagging broken layer at about 3000 AGL, clear below. My non-pilot passenger asked me to turn on the landing light so he could see the clouds. The ground was clearly visible between the clouds, and flight visibility was good, as well. After I turned on the landing light, I looked outside for maybe 10-15 seconds. When I looked back at the gauges, I was in a left-wing-down sixty degree bank, still rolling to the left. I don't think I could have recovered if I had not been current on instruments, as the roll and turn were perfectly coordinated, and everything "felt right", to the point of initially not believing the instruments. My passenger never noticed, and I never mentioned it to him.
--James Hammons jamhamms@aol.com
It can happen more than once while solidly in IMC.
--Herman Kuun oomkoos1@cs.com
No, I've honestly never experienced spatial disorientation while flying. But, I had an unfair advantage, even in the beginning as a lowly student pilot. You see, prior to ever taking my first "flying lesson", I was an enlisted Instrument Trainer Instructor in USAF's Undergraduate Pilot Training program, and so before I ever laid hands on the controls of a real aircraft I already had over 3000 hours of "Link time". In fact, my first CFI's biggest problem was getting me to stop flying totally "on the gauges" any time we were more than about 100 feet AGL. "See & be seen" was a foreign concept to me....
--Thom Flynn flynn@magicnet.net
Only once on my first night military pitchout for landing when the horizon was not visible. My initial roll went about 100 degrees but with a glance at the attitude indicator, I corrected both roll and pucker.
Question 2 should have checkboxes, not radio buttons. Someone boneheaded the HTML and SQL database code (if they are parsing the data to an Access or SQL...or even Oracle Database). I have experienced Spatial Disorientation in IMC, Night VFR, and under Training. Always look at the instruments!!! It never caused a problem, but I felt like I had a bad case of the leans. Bob
As a pilot in VC-33, an A-1 Skyraider night attack squadron (early '50's), I had to deal with S.D. many times, especially during night formation flying as a wingman. It was only a brief time before your senses told you your leader was rolling away from you; from then on it was a continual fight between brain and body to keep proper position. One vivid memory: Doing night bombing and rocketry under flare illumination on a small island called No Man's Land off Martha's Vineyard, I pulled up steeply and slewed the airplane around to look back and check my bomb hit, ignoring the briefing warnings. Suddenly out of the flare's cone of light, it was into pitch black in a steep climbing attitude and unbalanced flight. Immediately,I didn't know which way was up. Summer night, hazy, no moon; the stars blended in with the lights on Martha's Vineyard. By the time I centered the needle and pulled out, I was very close to the water. Hearing of young Kennedy's crash, had a strong sense of deja vu; I'd been there and almost done that. Subsequently, in a long career of flying, I encountered what we called vertigo many times, but never in as vivid and disorienting a manner as I described.
--Jim Patton jimp@atlantic.net
In a B200,taking off to the east at Point Barrow, Ak., I rotated and began to climb. Glancing out of the right side window I saw the moon below the flight path. I immediately thought that I was in a nose high attitude and my senses told me that I needed to lower the nose. I immediately got on the gauges and locked onto the HSI. I kept an 8 degree nose up attitude until about 2000 feet before I again looked outside. I experienced an almost overwhelming urge to lower the nose which would have caused the A/C to crash. Afterward I realized that the terrain was completely flat, absolutely no lights on the ground for reference and the rising moon all contributed to my Vertigo.
--david newkirk
not just one of the choices regarding when the vertigo happened... thanks to good navy flight training, there ultimately was never a problem. on question 2, all of the above is accurate, in my case.
Flicker vertigo in helicopters often. The only real scary one was leaving Tamiami after mid night bone tired got it so bad it was a long time getting it recovered. 5000 hrs It can happen to anyone. Dark night over the everglades!
--Robert Krieger
Very dark night over west Texas, few lights,no horizon. ATC called traffic at 1 o'clock, 500 ft higher. As I watched (fixated), he altered course and was now coming head-on. I went back to the instruments to avoid him, and was shocked to find that I was in a 30 degree right bank - I was the one who had turned. I returned to my previous heading, incident over. But I wonder what would have happened if I tried to "avoid" him without looking at the instruments, and what if I had decided to turn right? A 60+ degree bank, dropping nose, reluctance to turn back into the traffic,....
--Robert Turner
I have had this happen at night and also in marginal vfr--ALWAYS went to the instruments.
while flying over water, with in site of land, was looking down at the water for about 10 minutes. looked at the inst panel after the plane hit an insignificant air pocket and felt the worse case of disorientation ever. Good daytime VFR, but had my head down for so long, when it was raised, threw off the natural order of balance.
did not lose control-was relatively easy to nullify with concentration on the instruments...
Marginal night VFR on an IFR flight plan. We had just entered the scud with the strobes flashing. Everything combined threw me for a short loop but once we had secured the strobes and I focused on the instruments, it was all good. The co-pilot was ready to take over if needed. It can happen to anybody at anytime regardless of flight time or hours!
Just received my private pilot certificate. On one of my last training flights I was under the hood for quite a while and developed an uncontrollable feeling that I was nose over, headed for the ground at a steep angle. I concentrated hard on the instruments, scanned and cross checked, but the feeling would not go away. I finally peeked (OK sue me, I'm new at instrument flying). Another instructor later relayed what is apparently an old saying regarding instrument training, "a peek is worth a thousand cross checks", ain't that the truth. I learned that to become a competent instrument pilot you have to be able to overcome disorientation without "peeking", not an easy thing to do, a valuable lesson. A related note, the FAA allows 2.5 of the three hours on instruments requirement for a private pilot to be on an approved simulator. Bad idea. My simulator time was easy, it is much different under the hood in an airplane. Simulator time is great for learning procedures but I never heard of someone being killed in a simulator crash, one half hour under the hood in an airplane is not enough to license a private pilot. I have three under the hood and another two in the simulator. One hour of hood time is worth five hours of simulator time.
--Jim Clark jimclark@erols.com
I am blessed by geting it very badly all the time, so have learned to allways concentrate on my instruments. As a jet instrument instructor I learned to do all acrobatics on instruments, day and night, IFR, VFR.
--Philip H. Lacy avoice555@aol.com
I have experienced vertigo numerous times. I especially remember over the North Pole in a B-47 refueling behind a KC-97, the Northern Lights were really putting on a show and we were in and out of wx. Another time was straffing at night and the wx was so bad that the flare ship went home. I guess the rolling in on the target, bad wx, and the fact that the flares were gone really did a number on me.
--Jim Sanders dedemoo@edge.net
Vertigo is a challenge to be confronted with instruments or the real horizon. Fools die when they fly by the seat of their pants and this is not necessary to accept so dont die believe your attitude indicator.
--Bryce Guenther
Over Long Island sound enroute to Hyannis, got a traffic advisory from ATC, started swiveling my head (outside was kinda milky), next thing I know we're in a 30 degree bank...
--Robert G. Button
A/P saved my butt !
I've had one brief (< 5 seconds) episode in 4,000 hours of flying. I was shooting an LDA approach into Roanoke, VA one night. I broke out at minimums saw the runway lights, which told me the airplane was in a bank. I had not accounted for the 10 degree offset of the localizer relative to the runway. A quick glance back at the Attitude Indicator resolved the problem. There are so few SDF's and LDA's that pilots sometimes aren't prepared for what they'll see when breaking out. Another thought: it seems to me that some people are more prone to spatial disorientation than others. Quite frankly, I would not want to fly with someone who has had more than one serious episode.
I had a cold and had taken an-over-the-counter remedy. With drizzle and haze and a brief loss visual horizon, I ahd a classic vertigo incident. Had to sit on my hands and let the autopilot take it for a few minutes.
--rick pollack rpa123@cine.net
I was on my second lesson (Flying a Cessna 152) and doing a 30 degree bank to the right. Continuing this doing 360's I felt like we were going into a spin. I pulled out when I couldn't tell up from down or right from left. I was so light in my seat it reminded me of sitting on an raft in moving water.
Happened only once in 4,000 hours
--Kenneth Collett
Strongest case I ever had was at night in a F-106A during refueling. Although rationally I knew I was wings level, I had an almost overpowering feeling of being in 90-120 degrees of bank. Only faith in my instruments kept the shiny side up. In other cases of disorientation where red cockpit lighting was used, I discovered I could overcome the illusion quickly by turning on a white light- I always had a flashlight handy for that purpose.
--Gene Bricker gbricker@simuflite.com
The situation was a dark, winter night, doing an ILS into Waukegan during Instrument training. I was under the hood. The approach vectors you out over Lake Michigan and, as we got out past the shoreline, the ground (lake) and the sky became one huge black hole. The feelings of vertigo were almost overwhelming. It was, at the same time, an extremely difficult thing to do, to rely on the instruments and disregard my senses, as well as a tremendous training experience. I completed the approach to landing and it's a lesson I will never forget!
--Steve Purduski
I have had several opportunities to experience SD but I think concentrating on flying the instruments prevented it.
--Robert L. Clem
I hope I never experience it again. It's Horrible!! Up to that time I had just had a few hours of IFR training over a 6 month period. After that I got serious about it and got my instrument rating.
--Gary Chenier aviation@aviationthings.com
I hit this several times in IMC (only once under the hood). For this reason I've done a lot of my instrument training in IMC. I even had 4.5 hours ACTUAL for my private requirements. It's better to get the leans with an experieinced pilot in the right seat, especially with low hours. What's been really bothering me about the NSTB report on the Kennedy crash is that he had over 300 hours. I'm looking at 100 now, and I thought that by 300 hours, I'd be ok trusting the instruments.
--Jerry Plante
Almost overpowering Spacial Disorientation when making an IFR missed approach in a single pilot USAF jet. Only good training on this saved me. In over 50 years of flying, I have experienced a few milder cases on dark, moonless, hazy nights over terrain without ground lights--parts of the world where lights were few and far between or even totally nonexistent
--Lewis Neyland
This happened on a T-38 cross country. On the last leg of the trip, we did a TACAN penetration back at Webb AFB, and I was on the wing. Descending and turning while locked onto the "wingtip in the star", we descended through layers of little white puffies. On the right wing, and in a descending right turn, I was looking up at my lead, away from the ground, with no horizon. After we landed, I wrang a couple quarts of sweat out of my green bag and my "go slacks"(fast pants)(g-suit).
--Bob Buls
I am a low time instrument pilot but I find each time I fly IMC, it becomes easier to ignore the disorientation. Every pilot should get an hour or two of actual instrument time (in some turbulence too!) so they can see just how "real" spatial disorientation can be and how difficult it can be for a low time pilot to get on and stay on the instruments.
--Neal Garvin
I have had several episodes of spacial disorientation. Most of which were in actual IMC during my IFR training (a good time to have one with a CFII in the left seat). The first one was the scariest because my first reaction was disbelief at what the instruments were telling me, but I must have had good training because the next thought that came into my head was "Trust your instruments". I even had one on the checkride.
--Arthur D. Glesner
In twenty years of flying fighters in the Air Force,I experienced spatial disorientation in virtually every flight condition at one time or another, the worst of which was induced by acceleration vertigo on take off, at night, VFR in an F-101 Voodoo.
--Robert A. Hanson
In every phase of flight there have been momentary instances of vertigo. After 45 years of flying and 20,000+ hours, I thing it is a very normal occurrence.
--Arthur S. Koester koester@shentel.net
Had to keep reminding myself to believe the instruments. It would be very easy to loose concentration and become disorianted.
The easier they make it, the more dangerous it becomes.
--George Fredlund gfredlun@bellsouth.net
I was flying as a safety pilot at night. We were right along the mountains, and there was a low cloud layer. The line between the clouds and mountains was barely visible, and of course when I could see it it wasn't level. Fortunately I wasn't flying, but in that case I could have just looked in the other direction (towards a distant city and less clouds) to regain orientation. But even though it wasn't a critical situation, it really made me recognize the seriousness of it.
It lasted only about 5 seconds and I recognized it right away and resisted the temptation to look back at the city lights while flying straight out on a climb into a black night sky. When I fly at night I usually do several instrument approaches for practice since around our local area (ABQ) there are spots where it gets really black and at times it can seem like actual IMC. I thought about it later and realized that since I was preparing for my next approach I had just looked up from my chart and probably looked at the chart a little longer than I should have and moved my head too fast. The airplane was not on the intended course as I quickly discovered when I went on the gauges. I recovered without incident and was only off course 10-15 degrees and maintained the climb. For that brief instant my senses told me things were much worse. Fortunately I've experienced this sensation on a few ocassions and have learned a lot from this- even though I'm instrument rated it takes practice.
--Ken Morris morris.ken@worldnet.att.net
Instrument training is a life saver if you flight at night or at dusk in hazy east coast summer months.
--William Burgner
I was on a night IFR approach in the mountains, heavy snow and low fuel(sounds like a bad story already). I broke out well above min's into marginal vis due to the snow. I spotted a pair of strobe lights climbing toward me out of the snow. I immediately started a pull up & turn which totaly wiped out my inner ear & even worse was not the missed proceedure. Took 5 minutes of strong concentration on the instruments to settle down enough to figure out where I was and how to get back for a second approach. This time my mind interperted the strobes correctly as the end of the runway strobes which I was desending towards. All was well - except for the finger marks I left on the yoke.....
--B.W. Malcolm malcolm@electro-optical.com
ON AN NIGHTTIME SIGHT SEEING FLIGHT IN SOCAL - CRUISED IN A CESSNA NORTH ALONG THE COASTLINE. WHILE CLIMBING/TURNING BACK OUT OVER THE OCEAN I TILTED MY HEAD TO SEE THE SHORELINE UNDER THE WING. AS I LOOKED UP I HAD COMPLETE DISORIENTATION. I HELD MY CONTROL INPUTS AND FOCUSED ON THE ATTITUDE AND AIRSPEED INDICATORS. AFTER SEVERAL SECONDS MY I REGAINED MY COMPOSURE AND RESUMED MANEUVERING. RECOGNITION AND SOME INSTRUMENT TRAINING SAVED THE DAY.
--MICK BROADHEAD
When I was a new Navy Aviator, a lot of the other pilots aboard ship talked about getting the dreaded Vertigo. When I go up the courage to ask what it was, I found that I experienced it on every night IMC flight. Once I found out that I could overcome it, no big deal.
--Lynn Nelsen
My occasional experience with vertigo did not bother me much because I was aware of what was happening and I focused even more intently on my instruments. Occasionally it seemed I could hear the insistent voice of my old CFII, "Believe your instruments, believe your instruments, believe your ...."
--Glenn Woodman
C-124 - on takeoff at Hilo, HA. Heavy rain. Windshield wipers on. Almost immediately after liftoff, bad verdigo. Difficult to battle, but can be done.
--rodney howes airhowes@yahoo.com
Question 2 (under what conditions?) only allowed one answer. In addition to the one I checked, night vfr, I have, of course, also experienced it in training at the orchestration of my instructor. I also experienced it a couple of times, in perfectly good vfr conditions while looking at a map for too long then looking up after the plane had started to bank. Question three only allowed one answer too. I answered: a. concentrated on flying the instruments. That answer applied to night vfr. During training and looking at map too long, the disorientation was only momentary, and I recovered as soon as I realized what was going on. The looking at the map too long may actually be training too, since I haven't done it since I was a student pilot. But it did happen then on a solo cross country or two.
--William Lockman lockman@aepnet.com
Experienced flicker vertigo while landing to the west, viewing a low, subdued sun through a spinning propellor. It was transitory as the prop rotations got to that certain point. As the aircraft slowed and prop RPM slowed, the vertigo subsided.
--Allen Brown
While in primary flight training (About 35 hour level), flying from the back seat of a TL-19D (Birddog)on a rather bumpy day, I experienced the feeling of floating off the seat of the plane and the instruments in the panel seem to do funny things. The IP up front noticed my difficulty and took the controls until the sensations passed.
--Allen Brown
At Night in and out of clouds, or on top with a sloping cloud deck is the worse for me.
I've never lost control of the aircraft due to spatial disorientation, but I have had to fight body signals and trust the instruments. I felt I was in a turn when in fact I was flying straight and level. The disorientation soon passed.
--David Reville DLReville@aol.com
Very unusual sensation, not quite panic but very disconcerting.
--Chuck Ross
Well, at least I'm not aware of ever having experienced spatial disorientation. Hopefully I never will.
--John Trautschold
I was not instrument rated at the time but my CFI demonstrated to me that I could not trust my inner ear alone to keep the plane level. He had me put my head down and try to maintain straight and level flight. It didn't take long before I was in a descending right turn...from which I had to recover by looking at the instruments. That was enough to make me trust the instruments more than my inner ear.
--Mike Roth
Question 2 should allow multiple answers. I have been spatially disoriented in IMC shortly after I earned my rating (2 times) and in marginal vfr (VFR going south) just before I started my previously scheduled training for the rating.
--Don Lawrence
It scared the hell out of me the first time it happened. I realized that I only had one way to survive (I didn't have an autopilot or other pilot on board). Flying the gauges is important, you have to stay proficient if you fly IFR, not just current.
It was really insidious; departed the airport at night on a compass heading and followed the radial heading outbound, not looking at the flag; if I would have I would have noticed it was inoperative. I did a complete 180 degree course reversal before I noticed I was heading North for a Southbound destination. It took several minutes before I was able to get my bearings and heading together; very interesting indeed. I pay much more attention to my initial heading and run a minimum of two navigational sources during all stages of the flight now.
I have experienced spatial disorientation (vertigo, we always called it) many times during my 7,000 hours of flying various military aircraft. Learn to read, interpret and follow the aircraft instruments is a "must" for starters. Concentrated and concerted practice is the only way to master flying during imc, day or night. You must be completely focused on basic instrument control, plus you must be able to integrate instructions from ground controls, approach and departure charts, and enroute maps. There is no other way to fly imc safely. An interesting phenomenon I discovered many years ago while on a 2-ship night formation flight in solid imc. I was #2 on this leg of the mission to Tinker AFB, Ok., flying F-86F Air Force jet fighters. The air was relatively smooth, and maintaining position was easy. I noticed that if I held my position as close as possible, I had the feeling of "straight and level." However, when I raised my position very slightly, I would get the unmistakable feeling of entering and holding a turn to the left. Inversely, when I lowered my position just slightly below the correct position, I would experience the feeling of entering a turn to the right. The greater I changed either up or down from my regular position, the greater my bank "seemed" to be. I was intentionally producing a vertigo feeling, but I was not disoriented. The flight this first time seemed very short because I was doing S-turns, and 360's as we bored along through the night. I tried this little maneuver several more times over the next several years when the conditions were right and experienced the same feelings. This, of course, was not tried in other than smooth conditions. I thought this was interesting, but have found only a couple of other pilots that tried it found the same results. Most said they tried, but always seemed to be in level flight "feeling." Has anyone out there had the same experience? Al Gould, USAF Ret.
--Al Gould argolead@earthlink.net
only have flown vfr
--steve macrae
While flying VFR amongst broken cumulus between five and six thousand feet, despite glimpses of the surface, could not overcome the feeling the plane was descending. After climbing almost another thousand feet, concentrated on the instruments in order to resist the compelling urge to climb. Even then, my mind was wanting to mistrust the instru- ments.
--Lewis Porter
I was flying on a hot summer afternoon just before dark on a 200 mile cross country at 3500' from Kansas City back to Illinois. It was very hazy. All of a sudden I realized I couldn't see the ground. It was just a sea of grey all around me. I looked at my attitude indicator and I was in right turning descent. I immediately went to the instruments and started down to a lower altitude. In a few minutes I could see lights starting to come on on the ground. From that point the flight was normal nightime vfr.
I'm a low time vfr pilot. I think I've expierenced it driving or riding my bike... spenging too much time looking in the rear view or checking the sprokets... but not yet in the plane.
This occured while on a checkout flight at DM Aero Club. Instructor told me to look to my left and he induced a hard climbing right turn, I could not perform any manuvers the rest of the flight and felt like .... the rest of the day. But, came back the next day and finished the checkout (for free)
--Ken Dunn krd76ta@aol.com
Show me anybody that says they have not; And I will show you a lier. and one day a smoking hole.
It was my first part 135 job flying checks in an Aztec at night and one of the first nights on the job and it taught me how hazy summer nights are IMC regardless of how VMC it is supposed to be and should be treated as such.
--David Mauldin
Descending at night over a mountain ridge, started a spiralling turn. There were few lights and I quickly became disoriented. Lucky my attiude was mostly upright while my altitude was rapidly deteriorating and I did rotate back into some ground lights with several seconds to spare in my recovery.
--Peter Hendon
It happened at night between very heavy layers
--Richard Lemmon
Night flying for "hood" time.. Instuctor was Paul Moersch,of Altair Aviation, Pitt Meadows, B.C.(excellent inst.) directed me over a rural area which caused light to reflect off the top inside of the hood, and completely disoriented me. I wanted so much to look out the window, but Paul forced me to stay calm, and trust the instruments, and not my senses. After a few minutes of concentration, things went back to normal. Best experience I've ever had!
--Fred Carey
Standard basic private pilot training evidently is adequate. Remain calm and trust the guages.
I'd been denied a clearance through controlled airspace and was flying around the edge, trying to remain half a mile outside. It was IMC and I guess the continual bank upset my sense of balance. When tracking via the localiser, coming inbound, I found it incredibly difficult to hold attitude according to instruments, but after about a minute all settled down.
--Barry Sadler
I have only experienced it during training, but I know that it is a natural thing. I am sure that I will experience it again...and the solution is to trust those instruments!!!!
I have only experienced it during training, but I know that it is a natural thing. I am sure that I will experience it again...and the solution is to trust those instruments!!!!
I got my first taste of the leans during my private pilot training, with the first "under the hood" experience. I then went on to get my instrument rating, and occasionally got s.d. Since then, I have gotten hit with it if I go more than a month or two without practice. It leads me to believe that only six approaches in six months is hardly acceptable for currency.
--Matthew Reed
I feel fortunate to have experienced this condition first hand. It occured at night, under the hood, while training for an Instrument ticket. The presents of my instructer helped.
--Jay Haines
It happens, but isn't dangerous if you are aware of the possibility, and know what to do if it occurs.
One departure procedure for my local airport is a climb to 1700, followed by a climbing 180 degree turn. I often get the leans, IMC or under the hood. Just scan and interpret until it goes away.
None of my three spatial disorientations were as disabling as the FAA's demonstration device. Twice in heavy precip on partial panel and once in flight training. Just fly the aircraft and believe what instruments are operating is the only solution.
--Joseph Powell
take off at night from a brightly lit airport Into darkest night can be difficult at the best of times ,loose your gyro after lift off and you should consider yourself lucky to survive. This happened to me and I cannot help but feel that the intense training in unusual attitudes at night over water by my flight school really did save my life. I was certainly a victom of spacial disorientation ,in what seemed like an eternity but was really only seconds I went from a controlled take of fixed on the attitude indicator to a engine screeming right turning dive. I had one other distraction ,In the right seat was a senior who just kept talking. You cannot see the ocean and you cannot see the sky ,its all one big black area waiting for you to make a mistake and it does not forgive , the only thing in a pilots favor is the training he had and should have at every flight revue. I was lucky I was current and had lots of training in recovery over water at night from unusual attitudes. As a foot note I believe that the FAA should require pilots to be instrument rated for night flight at least were a portion of that flight would take them over water.
--Roy Bossons
There were a few nights when I pushed over for an approach to the ship when I was sure I was upside down. When I broke out underneath the ship was upside down too, so I just went ahead and landed anyway. Trust the instruments!
--Pete Field
In my instrument training (incomplete right now), I experienced the "leans" just about every time the CFI and I went up with me under the hood. A good deal of my training was at night, where there're fewer visual cues sneaking into your periferal vision, making it more likely to get disoriented. My first encounter with actual (dual with the CFI on a training mission) produced a pretty hefty case of the leans. In all case, I simply concentrated on my instrument scan (DG mostly ;)) and flew through it. I've done several approaches with my body telling me I'm in a steep spiral most of the time. So, what's the point of this particular QOTW? Doesn't everyone get the leans under the hood or in actual? LS
--lucien stavenhagen
6 miles in haze quickly turned to 2-3 in haze, blending in with green forest, causing an illusion of no horizon...not a good thing....got the instrument ticket right after that.
I'm old and senile I fly n4376 out of h88 and I'm disorientated all the time I think I'm perfect and all the birddog pilots in south east missouri think I'm perfect mascot of senility I just fool the FAA medical examiners because I lie.Just like my L-19 elite buddies we are a team we control the airspace over Fredericktown and we don't like outsiders even thinking about have a business at H-88 because we monopolise and were Catholic bigots. My best and favorite American traitor flys Birddogs and we both are planning covert activity.
After successful recovery and beeing on the ground again it occured to me, that my little autopilot could have saved me the heart bouncing.
--Dirk
Aproaching JFK from the Atlantic Ocean side in daytime hazy conditions at 7,000 feet, the first image is the sandy South shore of Long Island, from the lower left to the upper right of the A/C window. I often wondered how a VFR only aircraft would handle the condition?
--Arnie Allison arnieab@juno.com
Marginal VFR over water.
It was night VFR and I made a turn in the pattern towrds the ocean. When the lights and land were behind me I had total vertigo. All I could do to recover was look at the ADI. I almost killed my father-in-law and myself. I've never had it again since I got my instrument ticket. If you're a private VFR type, get your instrument ticket. And get some instrument dual. It's completely worth it. More instrument dual and not so much confidence/cockiness would have saved JFK, Jr.
--Mark Printup
It occurred after not flying for a few weeks and entering the cloud deck at about 500 feet. The disorientation was immediate. I took a deep breath, reassured myself that I could trust the instruments and it disappeared after less than 2 minutes.
--Ken Paige
I've been in a couple of situations early in my IFR flying "era" which caused the planed to end up in an unusual attitude. In each case, I just concentrated on the instruments, and reverted back to what I learned during my training. Things might not have come out so good if I was not current, or if I lacked sleep, etc. . .
Early in my IFR training flight I got vertigo inbound on the ILS. I was very impressed with how strong the urge and the senses were to correct for a false sensing. It made a strong impact on both focusing on the instruments and cross referencing them to ensure they weren't lying.
--Dave Billings
I was on a multi-instrument check ride with a hood on, looked at a chart for a sec while turning away from land towards water and thought I was diving and turning the wrong way. No panick, flew the gauges, examiner did not even know
Other than one time in training I have never experienced spatial disorientation, however after 23 years in the Navy, Half of that time at sea, I've never been sea sick either. Maybe I'm not normal.
--Thomas E. Cowell tecowell@exis.net
All CFII should demo this to their instrument students. The simplest way is to have the student do a standard rate turn for 720 or 1080 then give'em a heading to fly. Then wait for the "holy cow."
As with any "true story" especially on told by a military aviator mine starts with: there I was . . . Flying a SH-60F around the boat (the Indy) in the Yellow Sea off of the west coast of South Korea. We were conducting routinue carrier ops in night VMC conditions. The ususual suspects were present. No moon, little starlight, flat sea state, and a million fishing boats. Unfortunately the boats were only in one sector of our starboard D pattern and thus created an artifical horizon. As I rolled out of a turn and with the boats and all of their bright lights staring me in the eyes, I fell into the classic black hole scenario. I subconsciously pulled the collective trigger switch, thereby disengaging the autopilot altitude hold and began a gradual descent, starting off at 150 ft AGL doesn't leave much room wiggle room. The altitude alerter went off as advertised at 75ft AGL, and the whole crews heart stopped beating for a second or two while we figured out what the tone was and why we were in a rush towards the water. I wish I could say that I immediately pulled an arm full of collective, instead I froze and before I could react my ever vigilant aircraft commander had us back up to 150ft AGL with alt hold engaged. We later discussed the incident and he remarked that I had a 500-600 fpm descent rate in when he glanced at the IVSI and pulled pitch. A couple more heart beats and we would have ended up like Mr. Kennedy, though I doubt the government would have gone through the expense to pull our bodies out of the water unlike the Mr. Kennedy.
I fly both helicopters and airplanes and feel the effects most during night landings with gusting winds and minimal lighting in the chopper,
I have never experienced Spacial Disorientation, nor do I ever intend to. This is why one undergoes intensive instrument training to avoid, isn't it? Get you head out ahead of the airplane and fly using ALL those instruments.
--Daniel J. Shoop
I myself haven't had any noticeable encounters with SD, but I lost a classmate last year due to SD... False pitch up illussion was the fatal one that night. Nosed back into ground.
An extremely hazy afternoon (typical of summertime in Georgia) while on a MVFR cross country flight led to my holding the aircraft in a bank as the haze created a false horizon. This was more annoying than dangerous. I had to include the artificial horizon in my scan much more than normal.
--James Waggoner
The recovery from unusual attitudes never did induce any spatial dis. But, I do realize that we all are prone to it at one time or another and hopefully the training we receive will help us to survive it.
--Larry Phelps
Receiver air refueling at night, in the weather, with the moon on the horizon, in a 30 degree bank turn will cause some very bad spacial disorientation!
--USAF pilot
Question #2 should have multiple choices I've experienced SD in choices a, c, and d. Currently have more than 9,700 hrs. Anyone who does much instrument or low viz flying WILL experience SD at one time or another.
Never had it under the hood,or the first couple of times in IMC. Fortunately I had my instructer with me.I knew immediatly what it was,but had to be told to level the wings,and put myself thru a very uncomfortable 10 to 15 minutes.
--Joel Krenzer
My instrument instructor induced disorientation purposely. It was both an eye opener and a very convincing argument to trust the instruments.
I did get a brief case of the "leans" briefly one time in marginal hazy vmc, but recovered quickly by fixating on the 'A/I'
When I looked out side the aircraft the lights on the only road in a desert area didn't make sense as far as poition. The instruments said we were straight and level but when I looked out it wasn't right. This lasted for 7-10 minutes at which time I only believe the instruments and then finally the lights on the road crossed the winscreen at the angle that made sense.
--John Ford
One thing is for sure, if you do not concentrate on and believe in your intruments like you are taught, your flight will end in disaster....cannot be stated in any more simple of terms.
--Dana A. Berry
Funny story - Practicing formation acrobatics off Hawaii - hazy, and sea and sky all the same color. Leveling off for a while, I noticed my wingman very rough beside me. "What's wrong?" "Are we right side up or upside down?" He thought we were upside down, tried glancing inside to recage, but couldn't remember whether the black part of the attitude indicator was supposed to be on the top or bottom. However, I have spent hours on a guy's wing at night positive we were in a 45 degree bank. Noticed lots of other times when the lights on the ground and the stars all looked the same. My opinion after 17,000 hours is that spatial disorientation - even if its just the leans - is guaranteed if you fly. I recommend night visual problems training and spin training for every pilot. I also don't think there's any such thing as night VFR.
--Mike Hudgins
Immediately after takeoff, I made the turn toward my destination and was only 350ft AGL. The GPS which is usually set to "coarse up" was the first sign of the problem. When it started ticking my coarse off to the right and quickly, that is when I knew I was in a cloud. I think the GPS saved me.
Guess I'm lucky with 15K + hrs and no spatial disorientation.
You'll never know how to really handle disorietation until you actually experience it. I'm convinced that JFK, Jr., in spite of his good instrument training, had never actually experienced the spacially disorienting feelings that must have confronted him that fateful night last year.
--Chris Guild
I worked as an aerial photographer, and found a guaranteed way to experience Spatial Disorientation.... Just close one eye and look through a camera viewfinder while the airplane (preferably piloted by another) is in a medium to steep bank and/or turbulence. If this doesn't immediately make you sick, you're better than I am. The way to avoid this is to take "peeks" through the viewfinder interspersed with a "heads up" view of the (actual, not artificial) horizon.
--Jerry Cochran
I was surprised by how overpowering the middle ear can be. I am instrument rated (at that time for less than one year) and was legally current at the time of the disorientation. I entered IMC and began a climb. When I looked back at my Artifical Horizon it indicated that I was in a steep climbing 45 degree left bank. I couldn't believe it as it felt like a level climb but I told myself out loud to follow the instruments. I initiated a rapid roll to the right to level the wings and was instantly totally disoriented. I felt as if I was putting the plane into a dive to the right. Talk about frightening. My heart was pounding as if I had just ran a 100 yd dash. My head was leaning up against the left side window of the cabin but I kept my eyes on the instruments. I experienced some minor disorientation while working on my Instrument rating but with an instructor on board, it was no big deal. This time was different knowing that there was no one in the other seat looking out at the natural horizon. I managed to level the wings but the disorientation did not end until I reentered visual conditions about 20 seconds later. Those 20 seconds felt like 15 minutes. Always believe your instruments.
--Don Ressler dldress@ptd.net
Spatial disorientation can happen to any pilot no matter how much experience you have in IMC. Another case for me was both disorientation mixed with fatigue. I took off out of an airport in night VMC conditions to fly home which was only 10 min. away. There was a highway that you could follow to lead you right to the airport but there was also a very busy street that could sometimes fool you that went in a different direction. Well I couldn't find the airport and I had flown this route many times. After about ten minutes I remembered the AM radio station located almost right on the field so I dialed it in and followed it right in. The scary part is if I had stayed on that previous course, the terrain in that area turns mountainous. I would have been another CFIT statistic. The point is you can get disoriented at any time, especially when you're tired.
--Dan Palmer
My personal impression is that anybody that flys regardless of experiance is subject to spatial disorentation under any condition. What is important is to recognize the condition before it becomes a problem and take proper corrective measures imediately. The John Kennedy tradegy I feel is a classic example of not being properly aware of the quickness of spatial disorentation can happen and the importance of proper flying procedure to insure that it does not become a problem. I also personaly think more IFR type training should be given at the later stages of private pilot instruction encluding stong demonstration of spatial disorentation.
--Joe Aldendifer
Flying on Night Instrument Training flight headed North from Stockton Army Airfield in a "Bamboo Bomber" (Cessna UC-78) horizon lights appeared on a 30 degree angle to apparrant level flight. Immediate return, of reference, to the Attitude Indicator revealed we were still in true level flight!
--Doug. Nichols popuhq@aol.com
In my opinion, there are two kinds of instrument rated pilots. Those who have experienced spatial disorientation, and liars. I warn all my instrument students about this, and have been 'fortunate' enough to get into IMC with many of them when they had their first real bout. That is why training in real IMC where possible is so important, in my opinion. My last student and I blasted off into 300 & 1/2 the day before his check ride. He commented afterward that it really got to him when he got to the clouds so soon. He passed the ride the next day, and I'm sure the 'real' experience helped a lot.
The instruments never lie...Well, except when the vacuum pump silently dies, the static port is partially covered, the pitot is iced over...Hmmm...
During training, we flew down through a 500' cloud deck with ATC. It was bumpy, and at one point I had the impression we were "wings level" when in fact I was in a 30-degree bank. I noticed it while "breezing by" the attitude indicator on my scan. I never realised how much my brain and eyes cheat under the hood with the tiny bit of horizon it sees. As a result, my scan focused more on the altimeter and DG to get brownie points on precision. My brain never REALLY practised instruments until actual IMC. I think the FAA, TC and JAA should not give any instrument tickets until a pilot has had at least 1.0 ACTUAL IMC!!!
--Jason Fournier captain@airfournier.com
I am an instrument student and was conducting an NDB approach wearing foggles on an MVFR day. As I was executing a procedure turn over the ocean, my instructor advised me to lift the foggles to see what poor visibilty over open ocean was like. Being thus distrated from the panel for a moment, I had inadvertently leveled the plane and initiated a climb. As I replaced the foggles and focused back on the panel, my body felt that I was still in the turn. I immediately recognized the climb and began to correct for it, but I had to scan the TC, AI, and HI three times before I could believe that I was no longer in the bank. All three indicated wings level; I had to force myself to add rudder and aileron. A very convincing experience.
--Catherine Gagne
I've had S.D. twice, both times under the hood. The first was a night flight, during climb-out. The acceleration forces made me think our climb angle was too steep and I lowered the nose, accerlerating more...etc. I didn't notice what was happening until I'd pushed the nose below the horizon. I think my CFI was one second from taking things over when I finally got on track. The second time was during a sunny day. While under the hood, a shadow came across the instrument panel from upper left to lower right. My brain locked on to this as the "true" horizontal reference and my head tilted completely over to my right side. My right ear was nearly touching my right shoulder. My instructor (not the same one from before) had me hold my heading for what seemed like forever in order to keep that shadow in place. He finally took pity on my screaming neck muscles and gave me a turn that removed the shadow. My S.D. went away a few mintues later.
--Steve Genotte gopack@sprintmail.com
First, myself and my C170 are both rated for VFR ONLY. But...... We got caught in the soup while flying between layers and, like I have been trained, I started a 180 degree turn to get us out. I completed the turn and had us on the straight and level going toward VFR. Well, one look over to see if my girlfriend was still sleeping was all it took. Just this momentary lapse of attention was enough to get us into trouble. The instruments now indicated we were turning hard right and going down fast. The Graveyard Spiral. I instinctively leveled the wings (chalk that up to good training) and then gently raised the nose to level flight. I only overcorrected a little, +500 ft. We then initiated another turn to get us again going back in the right direction to find the marginal VFR conditions. This was without a doubt the most palm sweating, gut wrenching experience I have ever had. The feeling that you are on the very edge of death, going down at 2000 ft/min when you only starting at 2400 ft msl. You know there isn't a lot of time. I consider us Very Lucky to have survived this, where a lot of others haven't. We won't push this envelope again. Thanks for keeping us all well informed with a Very Good "paper"! Sincerely, Rex.
Occured between two cloud decks that were parallel but not horizontal - east slope of the Rockies
taking off to the north at TUL in a Jet Commander 1121, in the right seat during a left turn out, looked down to move the flap lever and looked up to discover my head had me 13 feet out in space doing cart wheels. the VSI looked liked a congential liar but it told the truth after all. it was shocking when i realized what was happening, like the stuff that just happens to others, and never to me.
--William Laatsch II
I am a low time, non instrument rated pilot. I experienced disorientation during a night flight, with a layer of clouds above me and no lights on the ground below me - in other words, very few horizon cues. I was aware that spatial disorientation might be a problem, and so was extra vigilant in cross-checking my instruments to my horizon. Sure enough, my "straight and level" was actually a 10 degree left bank. Easy enough to correct once I saw it, but only because I had been watching out for it in the first place!
I've been flying for years... have over 3,000 hrs and can recall when I was in training for my IFR ticket suffering from spatial disorientation. I wanted to come out of the hood and the instructor wouldn't let me! I thank him heavily for that! Years later... while flying IFR I suffered from spatial disorientation while flying IFR out of a mountain airport. My passenger wanted to talk at that time... and I didn't want to alarm her... so I just asked her to hold up for a while till I get us out of the clouds. I have to concentrate on the instruments right now! The spatial disorientation stayed with me for maybe 5 or 10 minutes and was a very strong feeling! However, looking at Kennedys experience I can't see how he would have lost it since he was 12 hours into a 25 hour IFR training program! Heck, with that much training and having just flown the same trip 2 weeks prior with an instructor in IMC I would think that he could have made it easily! One of the first things we learn is to not pay attention to our feelings... but to pay attention to the instruments!
--Ron Whitley Waterflyer@aol.com
I'm male, I'm macho, and I'm a pilot. I've never experienced spatial discombobulation and I never will because I am the sole ruler of my General Aviation. The government, my wife, and my job want to take my General Aviation!! I told them they can't have my General Aviation. Keep your hands off my General Aviation!!!!
--Rick Fullerton rful@megacolossal.galacticoversampling.machopilotsorg.net
In the military environment most pilots are afforded the oportunity to experience first hand some pretty good spatial D. Hence, the experience is an outstanding time to use the tools and training to properly recover and learn more for the next time. Having been both a military and civilian flight instructor, I feel the civilian training programs need more practical training in the recovery of spatial D. IMHO basic aerobatic training should be a requirement for the private ticket. If an airplane, any airplane can be rolled on it's back or pointed straight down then the pilot should have been there first and feel comfortable with the proper recovery. Go get some inverted time - it will last you a lifetime and may even save your life.
--Mike
At night, over mountains, fog/haze below, the scariest moments flying so far. While the scans vary, believing and TRUSTING those flight instruments are why I am here to write about it today.
Flying one night to IWD in Michigan's UP, I experienced spatial disorientation. The night flight was over an area of few ground references and a moonless night. After being confused by my senses, I concentrated on my insturments and the feeling of disorientation went away after about 5 minutes of serious sweating. I think being in contact with Minneapolis Center for flight following allowed me to relax and concentrate on the job at hand. It's always a good idea to have an extra pair of eyes on you if you can get the help. In my latest BFR, I made sure that I got more instrument training. Next time I will think twice before launching on a night flight over sparcely lighted terrain.
--Matt Byczek
On my FIRST solo away from the field, severe VFR/CAVU, I practiced steep turns and got a 'dizzy' feeling, I tried to recover from the turn, but instantly felt a marked increase in G-forces. I immediately realized I was messed up, and put my head in the cockpit, and recovered on instruments....no further problems...
this happened to me as a private pilot before any insturment training was required and I inadvertainly got my self into the clouds while scud running. I count myself very fortunate to have recovered control before running out of altitude in a near inverted attitude.
This was an insturment training flight. I was descending on a vector for Monterey. I was given a 270 degree right turn for spacing just as we entered the costal stratus. Upon rolling out or the turn and leveling off from the descent, we were still in the cloud. For the next several minutes, I felt like we were turning left when the plane was straight and level. I knew what was going on, but it still took quite a bit of concentration to ignore the feeling and fly the insturments.
--George Vasick
One night as I was climbing just after take off the lights from the runway reflected in the scratches in the side part of the windsield and gave me a real dose of the whirlies. Going inside right away took the feeling away and I never had it again.
--charles bateman
I credit the 3 second recovery to the extra IFR training I received 5 years ago. Though I don't have the rating (yet), and don't think it should be required, a good 10-15 hours should be required for the private.
Here in Australia we have a separate Night VFR course. A requirements of the training is at least one landing at an airfield remote from nearby lighting. Having made such a landing on one NVFR navigation sortie I launched into pitch black darkness - no lights ahead or on either side, and no moon - I had a wild case of the tilts. A good scan in such a case becomes truly essential. R. Scott Puddy's recent contribution on instrument scans is well worth a look: http://www.avweb.com/articles/cp_ifr/
--Tim Reid
I was in an F-86, over Arizona, northbound from Chandler. Radar broke lock on leader 5 miles away. Tried to acquire visually. Too much head movement and ended up with stars and scattered lights looking the same. (There was no moon.)I had heard about this occuring, but did not think it was possible. It is! Good instrument flying got me back to normal.
--Harold Alston n2263r@earthlink.net
I was at cruise altitude inbetween layers with no horizon. My head just started spinning. I just concentrated on flying the instruments and it went away. It seemed like it lasted several minutes but probubly lasted less than 30 seconds.
--C.J. VanderWeide
I experienced "controlled" spatial disorientation while working on my private pilot's license. Once was with my instructor and the other time was with the FAA examiner on my check ride. Both times they asked me to close my eyes and tilt my head down and fly the plane. They then asked me to make a turn to the right, then stop the turn and fly straight and level, make a turn to the left, and then fly straight and level. Then I was asked if I was flying straight and level. Each time I answered yes and then was told to look up. The first time I was in a steep climb to the right, the second time I was in a steep descent to the right. Time for recovery from unusual attitudes! This should become part of every pilot's training and now I'm working on my instrument rating.
--Jack Marchewka drsparky2@aol.com
trust your instruments and you don't get spatial disorientation
--craig haines
Occurred during my CFII training while adapting to the parallax of the instruments in night IMC. Never experienced it from the left seat.
My flight instructor wanted me to understand how easy it was to lose control of an aircraft during IMC so we went out over water, at night, off the island of Oahu. Even VFR it was very difficult to maintain control without constant reference to the instruments.
While I was working on my PPL, my instructor wanted to be sure I understood what it felt like to be thoroughly spatially disoriented and then required to recover on my own (with his own committed backup, of course). Dangdest feeling - could of sworn that I was lying smack down on my side against the door. Fortunately (albeit in this instance it wasn't absolutely required for survival) I was able to make myself pay attention to the instruments primarily due to the previous training I'd received in meditation. I'm shortly to resume my instrument training, having been temporarily distracted by the purchase of my very own personal set of Piper wings. They didn't come instrument equipped, but that's been cured, and it's time to put the hood back on. Onwards! Roland.
--Roland Coyote roland.coyote@gte.net
False impressions of pitch up after lifting off from oilrig deck on totally dark night. Saw nose down indication on AAI and forced myself to set correct pitch attitude although I felt we were pitching up. Handed control to other pilot when pitch attitude stabilised. Sensation ceased immediately on going heads up even though there was nothing to see outside.
--Tony Jones
ANY pilot who has found him/her self in IMC has (or will) experience spatial disorientation. If they say "NO" they are just kidding themselves. The answer is always "You MUST believe the instruments." or you are likely to die. Note that the word instruments is plural. A pilot can not rely on only one instrument. An absolute minimum of three (3) is the only way to be SURE of what the airplane is doing - - or more precisely - - what you THINK the airplane is doing. After all it may be doing fine. It's all in our heads.
--Bill Scott problem.solvers@botsnet.bw
Very Strong feeling of rolling / spinning after sudden hear clearing during a long descent from 13.000 ft
Taking off over a lake - no visual reference straight ahead. The instruments worked as advertised...
--Michael D Dewlen
I was flying solo over Lake Michigan at night and made a 180 back to Chicago. I lost the horizon when turning away from the coastline and had a heart-thumping few seconds until I saw lights again! I was totally unprepared for this situation but certainly will be next time. Just shows how easy it can happen and I have a lot of night VFR time.
--Roger Holden
I am inst. rated, but a recent night vfr flight over the desert was a real challenge. No lights on the ground and a false horizon due to distant mountains proved to be a handful.
--David Fisher
This happened while making a night high-altitude penetration descent in an F4D "Skyray". Worst case of vertigo I have ever had. I was flying wing and just continued to maintain my relative position to the flight leader. I had no idea what attitude we were in, but I could not afford to even take my eyes off him for a second to sneak a look at the vertical gyro. Had to absolutely trust that he was doing the right thing, which he was, although I would have sworn, according to my senses, that we were upside down. We weren't, and when we broke out 20,000 feet lower, my visual perceptions snapped back to normal. It was a good lesson learned...trust your instruments or your flight leader!
--Dave Mackie
The only time I have ever become spatially disoriented was while doing hood-work for my PPL. As a VFR pilot, I have not yet had the pleasure of flying into IMC. I have, however, lost visual reference to the horizon during a night XC from Alamogordo to Santa Fe NM (there aren't a lot of lights in that area).
--Dane Spearing
it was a mild form. during instrument instrument training in a T-38, with the white curtain enclosing the rear seat, in day vfr conditions, the effect of the sun breaking through edges of the curtain can cause some degree of disorientation especially if the sun periodically reflects off the instrument panel. None of this is actually disabling, but the effect of it can be a problem with your instrument grade for that flight. IPs don't take effects of the sun in consideration.
I early on discovered that at takeoff rotation (Vr} I could normally expect mild vertigo -- and I became prepared for it, and always briefed the CP before the roll. At the first indication, I'd announce it to the CP, go to the gauges and be fine in 30 secs. Hence I've always been leery of an IFR-qualified pilot who HASN'T experienced the "Big V," as I don't want to be aboard when it finally happens. Most military pilots expect induced vertigo during eval flights, and that's how I learned to counter its effects. I consider it a minor annoyance to be dealt with, as in combatting G forces and my ever decreasing bladder TBO.
--mike byington goarmy@ptialaska.net
What saved my life when I became disoriented were the words from my flight instructor.."Level your wings..check your attitude before you pitch" Trust your ability stay calm..
--Braxton BeFree23@aol.com
I received a shaky weather brief while filing a flight plan to Austin, TX. About 30nm into my trip I was dodging popcorn t-storms and flying through the rain. I am lucky that I got back in one piece. I am now working on my IFR rating 36hrs to go. It's a very serious matter when you have 120hrs and that happens.Thanks to Walter Mercer for teaching me how to stay alive.
--Harrison
The night I had it the moon was out but a scattered layer was about 1000 ft above. The moonlight shining through gave me fits and I told my partner what was happening but I want to fight through it but done let me do anything dumb. It took me about 15 minutes to fully recover but it was a frustating 15 minutes. I am glad I had another pilot with me just in case
trust the presentation,and scan , scan , scan !!!!!--- since,I fly,us ualy with non-pilots, there is no o ther option!
--rocketroy rocketroy@alltel.net
False horizon created by a narrow cloud bank infront of the moon and caused execessive nose up attitude..>I noticed decreasing airspeed and lowered nose and started flying instruments.
--Dave Moss
This is the most dangerous situation for a pilot in my opinion. I had my first visit in the "world of spatial disorientation" a couple of years ago,when i was giving IFR instruction on a PA28 in real IMC conditions. we got a a vacum pump failure in a curve and lost the control for about 10s(terrible) After that i released the controls for a while ,concentrate in my turn & bank indications and fortunely i was able to gain control again seconds after that but inside IMC as well. I was very fortunate to have had a good partial panel IFR training and because i was about 4500 agl,with a good terrain clearence.
--Ricardo Lima flight@instructor.net
SEVER TURBULANCE ON APPROACH. FULL CONTROL DEFLECTION REQUIRED . PA-30
--RAY M HALL
Practicing turns to headings under the hood w/ no restabilizing period between the turns. My instructor did it intentionally to throw off my 'seat of the pants' sense, and it was very effective!
--Cindy Zaharchuk
anyone that has much time in the clouds ( for some it may take seconds ) has had vertigo, some just dont admit it.
--Dennis Blankenbaker
I have experienced spatial disorientation in several different types of flight environments namely in the military doing formation flight under Night Vision goggles while flying over the water. Also flight at night military flying at low level in mountains. It's obviously an un-nerving experience, but knowing what to expect when it happens, and knowing how to overcome the sensations without losing aircraft control are invaluable.
--Doug Jacobs
This happened at night, over lake erie in IMC, after a very long day of flying. It was on the last leg home, and I got it BAD!
This happened the first time I flew in IMC during my IFR training, descending and turning in a fog bank while maneuvering for the ILS. Strangest thing I ever felt. I recovered on my own, but had the CFI not been sitting next to me, I would have leveled out, climbed straight out of the fog, and let ATC worry about it. Bizarre.
First experience with disorientation occurd during hood work on Priviate Pilot check ride. Training paid off.
--Norman Messinger
FAA has brought "the chair" to our EAA 690 Aviation Program and Pancake Breakfast and to our Georgia Wings Weekend. It's quite an eye opening experince. Every pilot should ride the chair at least once.
--Joel Levine
Airplane had two attitude indicators. They agreed with each other so I concentrated on flying the instruments although I felt like I was in a very steep banked turn.
--Ronald L. Larson
Poor judgment put me in IFR conditions and I had to rely on needle, ball, and airspeed to save my neck. In bad weather take the first piece of land that you can call your own.
--Lucky in Alaska
I think that spatial disorientation can result from expecting to experience vertigo, thus bringing it on. I've spoken with pilots who claimed to have never experienced the phenomenon, but also stated that they could have if they really wanted to. Interesting, huh?
Also night over water, taking off from Nantucket in a c-182
Although I consider myself to be a safe ,good pilot. I think that the one time experience with spatial disorientaion thought me a big lesson about how not to get into another one. It is like recognizing the stall to avoid a possible spin. Big lesson was learned from that one. Like Roy Rogers said: "Good judgment comes from experince, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment." Being alive and able to recognize that experience is a powerful feeling. One that can not be easily expressed. Or forget.
--ALi Pashayi
It4s good to have someone talk about this items so important in Flying.
--Nicolas Mejia
I believe instrument training should include plenty of actual in-cloud flying (at least a couple of hours, in at least a half-dozen separate segments). My worst incident of 'the leans' occurred after I had my instrument ticket and had flown in actual IMC a couple of times, including making actual IMC approaches. And yet the need for intense concentration on the instrument scan had not yet been ingrained in me. The incident was frightening, but it taught a valuable lesson because I overcame the problem. If I hadn't, we would have been just another statistic, with NTSB making up some Probable Cause report.
--Brian Bragg
Spatial disoreintation can happen to anyone. In it's full form vetigo is extremely diabling. Why no one has ever developed attitude reference instruments that utilize peripehral vision to maintain orientation, I'll never know. Seems like an obvious answer, especially for sport flyers.
--megamouse
I was glad to have experienced spatial disorientation at a time when an instructor was on board. It's a feeling that I don't care to experience again, but having had the experience is good in that I would now know what to expect.
--Karen Lemke
learn to fly with two parameters: gyro or brujula and altimeter or variometer
--pedro gonzalez
I was in jump seat and the pilot in command flew with the intent of inducing spatial disorientation for training purpose. It was great training.
I think it's like asking "did you ever bounce a landing". And the answer to, "How do you recover" is the same: "You fly the airplane".
There is a simple way for John Q. Public to experience spatial disorientation... while on a commercial aircraft, say a 737, when the plane begins a turn, stare at the ceiling and in a few seconds you will not be sure if you're straight-and-level, still turning, etc. It's a very interesting effect... except in the cockpit! ;)
--Jason Fields